has anyone else had problems with mdf?

[eagleta2]

I have had almost no luck working with the stuff...

1. I think it creates too much fine dust that is much harder to control than regular wood dust.
2. I haven't had any luck in joining mdf to itself. It doesn't seem to have any screw holding torque in the edge or face. Maybe I am just using the wrong screws.
3. I can't plane or joint it for fear that the glues used will severely dull my knives.
4. I also worry that it will severely dull my favorite saw blade

Maybe I'm just afraid of it and nobody has been able to convince me of the benefits...

Thanks
Geo

[Gene Howe]

#1 Yep.
#2 Yep. But, dados/rabbets and glue work well for joining.
#3 Yep. Not a good idea to joint or plane anything with glue in it.
#4 Nope. At least not carbide tipped blades. Cuts like butter.
Benefits: Flat, good paintable surface, excellent pattern and jig material (not for hundreds of uses, though) good substrate for veneers.

BTW, heard it was going to be in the 70's down there today. Any truth to that? Just above 40, here on the mesa.

I have had almost no luck working with the stuff...

1. I think it creates too much fine dust that is much harder to control than regular wood dust.
2. I haven't had any luck in joining mdf to itself. It doesn't seem to have any screw holding torque in the edge or face. Maybe I am just using the wrong screws.
3. I can't plane or joint it for fear that the glues used will severely dull my knives.
4. I also worry that it will severely dull my favorite saw blade

Maybe I'm just afraid of it and nobody has been able to convince me of the benefits...

Thanks
Geo

[STB]

I have had almost no luck working with the stuff...

1. I think it creates too much fine dust that is much harder to control than regular wood dust.
2. I haven't had any luck in joining mdf to itself. It doesn't seem to have any screw holding torque in the edge or face. Maybe I am just using the wrong screws.
3. I can't plane or joint it for fear that the glues used will severely dull my knives.
4. I also worry that it will severely dull my favorite saw blade

Maybe I'm just afraid of it and nobody has been able to convince me of the benefits...

Thanks
Geo

This reply is not to convince you to use MDF but rather share my experience. I had never used MDF. Last year I decided to experiment with MDF. I agree it is very dusty. Joining pieces, I used Tightbond glue it held well during testing of several different joint stress tests. I used screws with coarse threads the kind used in particle board. Screw holes were predrilled. I also used contact cement under all metal components. I used carbide blades and cutters to cut & form the pieces and didn't notice excessive ware. But everything I read said it causes premature wear. I will use it again for future painted projects & light duty jigs & fixtures.

This a garbage container that is used many times a day.
[ATTACH]19965[/ATTACH]

The shelf & flat picture frames are MDF. I used the SS miter cutting fixture on the picture frame joints (0 gap at corners my SS miter fixture is dead on) and glue only no fasteners
[ATTACH]19966[/ATTACH]

The hutch is 100 percent MDF no wood.
[ATTACH]19967[/ATTACH]

[Gene Howe]

Glenn,
Some very good use of MDF. Excellent projects.

[dusty]

Yes, MDF does dull the cutting edges of your tools (everything used to cut/shape) faster than most other woods. If you want to experience dull in a hurry, cut up some mesquite.

But that is simply one of the prices you pay to work with MDF. You simply have to figure that cost into the project. If it is too high, don't use MDF.

True, screws don't hold as well in MDF as in other woods but if that is an issue, don't use screws. When I have to edge join MDF, I use biscuits, tongue and groove or dowels. On joints at the edge, I use rabbets. Dadoes work well.

If the project is likely to get wet, don't use MDF However, if you get a good coat of paint on ALL exposed surfaces, MDF will survive well.

Wear a mask when working with (cutting, sanding, routing) MDF and make maximum use of your dust collection system(s).

I hit a gold mine about a year ago when I was given a large pile of lumber. A great deal of in was good quality 3/4"x10" cherry veneered MDF. This is not the typical box store MDF. It is dense and heavy. I had to learn to work with it.

When it comes time to move furniture built with MDF, count on needing help. It is heavy.

Other than what I have stated here, I find little else wrong with MDF.

stumpbuster: I love your furniture and decorating scheme. Does any of that antiqued paint tend to chip off.

[wa2crk]

When joining MDF with screws you have to predrill. Also it is a good idea to drill a countersink on one half of the joint. This will provide a space for glue to go and also some debris that will normally get between the pieces and raise the joint line. Providing this debris relief will keep the joints flat.
Several years ago I bought a bunch of MDF for some garage cabinets and they worked out well even where screws were driven near the edge.
The newer stuff is a different color and screws driven near the edge will cause a crack. The older material is a yellow color and the newer is more of a brown cast. I have had the brown stuff develop a crack even when putting nails in with an 18 gauge air nailer.
Biscuits seem to work well for joints however.
Bill V

[eagleta2]

#1 Yep.
#2 Yep. But, dados/rabbets and glue work well for joining.
#3 Yep. Not a good idea to joint or plane anything with glue in it.
#4 Nope. At least not carbide tipped blades. Cuts like butter.
Benefits: Flat, good paintable surface, excellent pattern and jig material (not for hundreds of uses, though) good substrate for veneers.

BTW, heard it was going to be in the 70's down there today. Any truth to that? Just above 40, here on the mesa.

Hi Gene

Thanks for your replies... you're correct...its a beautiful mid 70's day in phoenix. My shop is a very comfy low 80's. I'd be playing out there more if I didn't lose as filling in my tooth and had to go the dentist. Really lucky that they were open today and able to fix it without a root canal/crown or a dental implant! I can't help it...I tend to think the worst.

Come n down and we can spend time in my shop...then you can repay the favor in say...August? Lol

Thanks
Geo

[Gene Howe]

OUCH. BTDT several times. Pop corn and sugar daddys will do it every time.
Thanks for the invite. We don't get to Phoenix very often, though. Just usually to Sky Harbor. But when it get's above 100, you are welcome here. We usually run 20 deg or so lower than the valley.

Hi Gene

Thanks for your replies... you're correct...its a beautiful mid 70's day in phoenix. My shop is a very comfy low 80's. I'd be playing out there more if I didn't lose as filling in my tooth and had to go the dentist. Really lucky that they were open today and able to fix it without a root canal/crown or a dental implant! I can't help it...I tend to think the worst.

Come n down and we can spend time in my shop...then you can repay the favor in say...August? Lol

Thanks
Geo

[reible]

Hi,

Thought I might do a little show and tell. I use MDF for a lot of jigs and other simple projects. I don't like it for larger projects as the weight is not one of the things I normally look for in a material. Off hand smaller speaker cabinets are an exception.

A lot of things around the shop lend themselves MDF and the fact is very dimensionally stable.

If you fancy bisque fastening this stuff works quite well with them. Holding screws is not too bad but if higher stresses are involved they can pull out. Glue works well, ends will take up more glue then the flat sides so I often glue twice. (quick coat then a second reapply on ends/edges)

I have no problem cutting it but as mentioned it can create a lot of "dust" so setting up to collect that dust is a good idea. Remember the dust you don't see is the one you want to catch more of. Heavier chips can be done later by hand vacuum or dust brush.

I use for the most part carbide edges and I don't believe the wear is much of a factor. I also believe that drill bits and those sorts of tools are like wise not effected all that much. You would have to do a lot of projects before you have to even start worrying.

Now I can't remember what these screws are call or where I got them but since they work in particle board they will most likely work well in MDF. Here is a picture of the screw, you need to get the matching drill bit which I wasn't able to locate tonight so it is not pictured. Perhaps someone else can remember the name? (Drill bit is expensive).

[ATTACH]19968[/ATTACH]

Ed

[letterk]

Now I can't remember what these screws are call or where I got them but since they work in particle board they will most likely work well in MDF. Here is a picture of the screw, you need to get the matching drill bit which I wasn't able to locate tonight so it is not pictured. Perhaps someone else can remember the name? (Drill bit is expensive).

[ATTACH]19968[/ATTACH]

Ed

Confirmat Screws - good for MDF and particle board.

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=652