it isnt often that we have a chance to say thank you

[Hobbyman2]

I seen a article a while back where a team of college students teamed up with a climate scientist on the north west coast of Alaska , for eons there were tales from the locals of people who migrated from the northern most areas in north america to a place on the coast that didn't freeze, legend has it they had to to survive the ice age, some scientist called these tales crazy and said hey had no proof, these kids and the scientist went to the area along the coast where this survival was supposed to have taken place and sure enough after doing the back breaking labor of digging they found articles that proved the tales were true . so there was life in the arctic long before the ice age . that means the earth may be going back to what it was before life as we know it . at one time one of the oceans had to be larger do to the continental drift , explains the size of hurricanes ans storms had to be bigger ,,, about the trees being planted, it looks like the wood worker will still be in business a few centuries down the road , it may not be a dying trade after all and I for one am all for it ! thumbs up to those people for at least doing something. jmo

[Gene Howe]

+1000,Hobbyman2!

[moggymatt]

I believe what's needed to solve the issue at hand can only be the scientific method.
(1) Through direct observation,over the last 40 years, I've noticed a significant number of individuals, young and old, claiming that climate change is of major concern. Some to the point of panic and or hysteria. And that ist caused by humans.
(2) Also through direct observation over the last 40 years, I've noticed a significant number of unqualified individuals in leadership roles trying to convince the general public that climate change is the single most important issue of these times.

NO DOUBT ABOUT THE CORILATION BETWEEN (1) AND (2).

(3) Through direct observation, over the last 40 years, I have not seen all the lakes in the eastern U.S. die due to acid rain as warned about. Nor an ice age occur as warned about. Nor a single city on either the Atlantic coast, or the Pacific coast lost to the oceans. (None lost to the Gulf of Mexico as far as any news agency has reported so far either). The mid west has not been stripped clean due to an inrease in tornadic activity, the small stream by my house has never dried up, and thanks to responsible conservation practices, the wildlife in my neck of the woods(literally) has seen steady increases in small game, large game and migratory animals. Now I'm just one guy in one small area of the country (NE Washington St) but my brother in mid state N.Y. says the same about that area. Some years are wet, some years are dry, some springs are early, some springs are late.

My personal scientific conclusion is that No. 2 is the more likely cause of number 1. And for anyone who missed it, unqualified individuals in leadership roles, usually politicians, all fall in the number 2 category.

[jsburger]

You know, mankind is so arrogant. We think we know everything. Try and contemplate infinity and the universe. We know what a foot or a mile is but infinity? It is unimaginable. We are hardly a blip on the radar of what we think is the age of the universe.

When Krakatoa erupted in the pacific in 1883 it affected the climate around the world.

"In the year following the 1883 Krakatoa eruption, average Northern Hemisphere summer temperatures fell by as much as 1.2 °C (2.2 °F).[12] Weather patterns continued to be chaotic for years, and temperatures did not return to normal until 1888.[12] The record rainfall that hit Southern California during the water year from July 1883 to June 1884 – Los Angeles received 38.18 inches (969.8 mm) and San Diego 25.97 inches (659.6 mm)[13] – has been attributed to the Krakatoa eruption.[14] There was no El Niño during that period as is normal when heavy rain occurs in Southern California,[15] but many scientists doubt that there was a causal relationship.[16]"

The planet recovered from that.

As every one knows "Mother Nature" is unpredictable. Man didn't cause the ice age, man didn't cause the dinosaurs to disappear.

Are we responsible for what is going on now? Maybe but I doubt our contribution is a significant input.

The sun is our life source. Has anyone seen any reports of a change in the sun's output? That would make a difference.

This doesn't mean that we should not reduce our "carbon footprint" but at what cost?

[Hobbyman2]

Good points John ,
carbon is a element ,trees need it to live ,, ya cant make more you can only redistribute it , sooner or later nature will do what mother nature does .

[ryanbp01]

Have we, as a species, contributed to air pollution, land pollution, and ocean pollution? The answer is a resounding YES! The Great Pacific Garbage Patch, nuclear plant meltdowns, landfills running out of space, animal species becoming endangered or extinct due to habitat destruction are but a few examples. I believe that the little time we spend living on this little planet should be as stewards of our earth. Whether or not climate change is caused by human activities is not the point; the point is whether or not our activities exacerbate the problem of climate change. Think of it from a woodworking perspective: how many ash trees would we now have if not for a little green, metallic insect hadn't been introduced to our country? Or, how much will it cost for those lovely hardwoods we get from a rainforest after the land has been cleared out for crops? For those who have been woodworking for a long time and remember their dad or even their grandfather woodworking, what woods are now harder, if not impossible to obtain? Maybe on an individual basis, you may not think we contribute to climate change, but collectively, as the global population has dramatically increased, all of those little bits really add up.
BPR

[Hobbyman2]

ryanbp01
Good point , I would say these folks are about as good as it gets.
as far as trees being hit in this area I think the ash is the only one , I know in the west the pines were whit with bark beetles .
You make a good point though , when I was a kid ya couldnt walk along the river or lake shore with out cutting your foot on glass .

[bainin]

Looking at your thermometer outside your window for a couple years doesn't tell you anything about the global average. Just because its sunny and 75 outside your door, doesn't mean the whole planet is sunny and 75.

There is plenty of verifiable data from reputable sources supporting the observation that the global average temperature is increasing over the last 50 -100 years at a rate we haven't observed since the data has been being taken (couple hundred years).

Whether humans are contributing or not to the changes , that answer doesn't matter to me and has nothing to do with the observation itself.

Scientific method is grounded in

1. Observing a phenomena
2. Coming up with a theory as to why its happening
3. Testing the theory


We have observed the phenomena of global warming, we have a theory that we may be part of the problem.

Its now time to test.


b

[reible]

So how about this little fact:

"Emerald ash borer threatens the entire North American genus Fraxinus. It has killed at least tens of millions of ash trees so far and threatens to kill most of the 8.7 billion ash trees throughout North America."

I think we need to get planting some trees to replace all of these trees so we can keep woodworking going for the next generations. No wood, no woodworking.

Ed

[Hobbyman2]

For years I tried to stay neutral and base my own opinion on science and hard evidence as what could be happening , no opinions only facts ,as many facts and where trees came into play ,,, so far there has been a lot of facts not mentioned and ignored by the alarmist side , there has been a lot of opinions on the denier side that make as much sense and have not been addressed by the alarmist side, when a denier asked a question ,for a long time all ya heard were personal insults and how some folks were not educated enough to make any decision on their own,hw only a few were smart enough to answer questions ,, yet none mentioned trees,, from what I have found out, based just on the science, and based on how long we as puny little humans have actually documented weather and weather patterns , it has became apparent that there are a lot of facts based on theory ,means they are not real fats only a opinion , just as the computer programs were written /used in setting off these alarms .I hear scientist can track co2 in limestone, well that makes sense because it takes co2 to make limestone,so what about dna in the glaciers? there has to be some dna in the glaciers that would tell us where the glacier water came from ,I do know there was life before the glaciers and before the arctic ice , the alarmist side claim those who ask this question are not educated ? What" I " do know is co2 is the building blocks of plant life , with out trees algae in the waters will thrive out of control , this we see today, with out trees the earth surface will warm, if nothing else just because thee is no shade ,we are seeing this today,, I do know the more shade the more moisture on the the earth surface , we see this today in the rain forest ,, with out trees that dont deal with seasonal change the oxygen levels will decrease , with out fruit trees animal life like bees will die , there use to be trees along creeks ad rivers in this area and the water in those waters was cooler , now many fence rows around here have been cleared , the water in those creeks are now warmer and erosion is a issue ,a century ago the American Chestnut in the Appalachians went extinct ,what I do know is there are coal on tops of mountains in some areas , that means there was foliage before the continental drift made those mountains , so what I can say with out argument is,, trees are a part of this world and we dont have enough.